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October 13, 2008

Democrats Object To Fundamentally True Statement

I might not have made the comparison, but I certainly won’t repudiate it – and wish that the McCain team had not done so.

The chairman of the Virginia Republican Party has compared Democratic presidential nominee Barack Obama to Osama bin Laden because of the Illinois senator's past association with Bill Ayers, who has confessed to domestic bombings as a member of the Vietnam War-era Weather Underground.

Virginia Democrats, and some Republicans, are outraged, saying these are the latest in a series of inflammatory statements that the GOP has made against Obama in Virginia, a state that has emerged as a crucial battleground in the election.

According to a report in this week's Time magazine, the Virginia party chairman, Del. Jeffrey M. Frederick (R-Prince William), told Virginia volunteers working for GOP nominee John McCain that Obama and bin Laden "both have friends that bombed the Pentagon."

"That is scary," Frederick said while providing talking points to GOP volunteers in western Prince William County as they prepared for a door-to-door canvass.

Now let’s be honest here – Frederick was wrong on one point. Bill Ayers did not have friends who bombed the Pentagon; he actually participated in the bombing personally as one of the leaders of Weathermen. That would make him more akin to Mohammad Atta than to Osama bin Laden, though both less competent than the hijacker in the carrying off his attack and less willing to give his life for his anti-American cause. For that reason, I’d argue that Bill Ayers is more akin to Eric Rudolf, Ted Kaczinski, or Tim McVeigh than he is to Osama bin Laden. Not that this makes him any more savory than the murderous Islamists with whom our nation is today at war.

But somehow, that should not make the association between Obama and Ayers any more acceptable. Indeed, those who have absolved the former domestic terrorist of his sins against America do a grave disservice to the country in doing so. And that Ayers today makes his living off the same government that he attempted to overthrow – something for which he remains unrepentant to this day – is another offense against this country.

Does this make Obama guilty of Ayers’ crimes? No, of course not – but his willingness (and the willingness of so many in the Chicago/Illinois political machine and the national Democrat establishment) to embrace him and work to make him a mainstream political figure is disturbing. Would McVeigh’s co-conspirator Terry Nichols ever be allowed a similar rehabilitation? Would any politician who associated with him after his involvement in the Oklahoma City bombing ever be considered acceptable by the American people? I don’t think either of those questions requires much consideration to answer.

And make no mistake – Ayers certainly had not repented of his treason and terrorism at the time Barack Obama worked with and for him. After all, this was a man who wrote in glowing terms of his acts of violence against the government of the United States in 2001.

In his 2001 memoir, Fugitive Days, Ayers brags that he helped blast NYPD headquarters in 1970, the U.S. Capitol in 1971, and the Defense Department in 1972. “Everything was absolutely ideal on the day I bombed the Pentagon,” Ayers writes. “The sky was blue. The birds were singing. And the bastards were finally going to get what was coming to them.” Ayers also appreciates “a certain eloquence to bombs, a poetry and a pattern from a safe distance.” He called dynamite “That most romantic of nineteenth-century radical tools.”

Obama continued his association and affiliation with Ayers even after those words were widely publicized at the time of their publication. There could be no mistaking him for someone who had repented and been rehabilitated. It is pretty clear that he still adhered to the same violent platform of three decades before, even if he no longer actively engaged in acts of terrorism.

And therein lies the disingenuousness of those who want to defend Obama’s association with William Ayers. Their willingness to forgive Ayers is predicated upon their support for the cause in which he committed terrorism acts of treason and terrorism against his own country – or their willingness to ignore them in the interest of furthering their own political careers. Consideration of that fact ought to be of serious importance in this race, and those who would silence or minimize that issue (as well as Obama’s other unsavory associations) do America a grave disservice.





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you are so full of bullshit!

|| Posted by tony, October 13, 2008 09:39 PM ||

Have you even bothered looking at the history of the Weather Underground? The only people to die at their hands were a few of their own who botched an attempt at building a bomb. In fact much of their time was spent creating plans that would avoid the taking of human life in their bombings. Get your facts straight, its a lot easier to make your point when you don't have to rely on lies to get there. And while you bring this up how about Sarah Palin's ties to the Alaskan Successionist Movement? If Obama is palling around with terrorists then Sarah Palin is bedding someone who supports treason. And I'm sorry have you forgotten McCain's membership in group dominated by racism and neo-nazi's the WORLD ANTI-COMMUNIST LEAGUE?

Out of all those associations Palin's is the most concrete, while neither McCain nor Obama can be said to have a close relationship to either Ayers or the most fanatical right wingers of the World Anti-Communist League. However what is most alarming is that its McCain's judgment that's most in question, he was involved with the Keating 5, the World Anti-Communist League (who he never spoke out against), and he picked Palin, an unvetted, and unqualified bumpkin who has just been found to have violated Alaskan ethics laws in the trooper gate investigation.

There are plenty of wrongs on both sides. But all your accusations do are incite hate, racism, and prejudice. In case you've forgotten we live in a country in which assassination of political figures has historical precedence and if you're supportive of that or sentiments that would encourage it then you yourself are treasonous and guilty of one of the highest crimes against your own country.

Shame on you for supporting these falsehoods and hatreds. It is unchristian, un-republican, and most of all, un-American.

|| Posted by Stop the Hate, October 14, 2008 05:44 AM ||

I would suggest that you look into the lives of each individual that has known Bill Ayers, worked on boards with Bill Ayers, studied under Bill Ayers.  I think that EVERY politician, including all those right leaning ones in Chicago that has ever had ANYTHING at all to do with Bill Ayers turn over full disclosure of their relationship with him.  As well, if this is the case I believe that every member of government, local or national should go through the rigoruos process of finding every possible connection to anyone associated with any crime ever.  Let's also begin with John McCain who was personal friends with Financial Terrorist Charles Keating.  A man that John and Cindy McCain not only did business with, but also enjoyed leisure time with.  I am sure that that should be important. 


Yes, let's just keep throwing the hypocritical bullshit of association out there, let's just keep encouraging volatile crowds of individuals who may be disturbed enough to do harm to Obama or his family.  Let's just keep encouraging the ingnorance of association and suggest that because his name isn't Americanized enough and he isn't light enough, and he has "questionable" friends that he probably has a much, much deeper relationship with Ayers and that maybe they're plotting to bomb the White House.   And NOONE on the right could possibly ever have questionable connections, including John McCain.  But this is a right wing blog, so of course you wouldn't suggest that would you?

|| Posted by Barbara, October 14, 2008 08:37 AM ||

So let's see if I can summarize the above comments.

1) Can't refute the argument, so let's throw around profanity.

2) The Weather Underground was a terrorist organization, but they were so incompetent that they never actually managed to kill anyone other than their own members, so that makes them OK -- and besides, Todd Palin's brief membership in a peaceful political party outweighs involvement in terrorist activity. Oh, yeah -- I've committed treason by daring to speak negatively about Obama and his associates, even when those statements are factual.

3) I'm a racist because I don't question the political connections of every Chicago politician who has ever had any interaction with Bill Ayers -- even though the only one running for President is Barack Obama, so he is the only one I can do anything about right now.

Yeah, that's the Obamabots for you -- spewing their own unique brand of hate in an effort to de-legitimize anyone who dares to speak against their New Messiah.

|| Posted by Rhymes With Right, October 14, 2008 04:37 PM ||

Let's correct your summary:

1. The argument's relevance is refuted, because:

a. every well-connected Republican and Democratic businessman, lawyer, politician and educator has an association with Bill Ayers, so that vast a number of people cannot have violent/terrorist proclivities or questionable ethics

b. McCain and Palin and, for that matter, every major politician in America has passing associations as "worrisome" as the one you highlight; for example, McCain has a campaign advisor who protected a terrorist responsible for bombings to protest the Castro government in Cuba whose bombs killed several people including a father who died in the arms of his 13 year old child

c. Obama has a number of positive associations that you do not highlight, and a number of actions and words that accord with the majority of his associations and contradict the implication being drawn with respect to his relationship to Ayers

d. the hypocrisy shown in mischaracterizing Obama's associations while ignoring McCain and Palin's shows brazen partisanship that ruins your credibility with open-minded, rational Americans (which is why the polls are not benefiting McCAin as a result of the argument).

2. WU can be called a terrorist organization given that the definition of terror is the use of extreme force to scare people into a certain action. For example, Al Qaeda wants us out of their holy lands (including Saudi Arabia) so they fly planes into twin towers to scare America into submission. Or the US during WWII rejects State Department calls to drop the first atomic bomb in the harbor rather than on a populous city to scare the Japanese to surrender and scare the Russians into avoiding confrontation over the island of Japan. You will no doubt reject the latter as terrorism, although it technically fits the definition, thereby highlighting that one man's terrorism is another man's just war. So I ask you who is more morally culpable? The man who takes measures to avoid loss of life while making strong statements against an unjust war or the man who flies planes far above the ground indescriminately bombing civilians along with soldiers in waging a war now largely regarded as unjustified?

3. We don't think you are a racist, just a biased partisan that sees the mote in Obama's eye but misses the beam in McCain's eye. You lack credibility when your logic is selectively applied. If you really question Obama's judgment, then find actual deeds he has done or policies he has pushed that show that lack of judgment. And objectively compare that record to McCain's, including his achievements and failures. Some very reasonable people have done this and have reached the conclusion that Obama is the better man for the job, and we are not even star-struck or biased as we do so. We don't see him as a messiah or a celebrity, but as a brilliant man who wrote two great books, completed very difficult academic courses of study with honors, demonstrated selflessness by passing on Wall Street or blue chip law jobs to help poor people, ran a brilliant campaign against the Clinton machine to get the historic nomination, and continually shows the smarts and charisma necessary to get the country through a crisis as FDR could and Hoover couldn't 70-some years ago. Insult if you must, but don't underestimate the thinking behind many of Obama's supporters--afterall, we are now clearly in the majority...

|| Posted by dg, October 15, 2008 03:59 PM ||

There's a point here I've wanted to get back to in regards to Todd Palin -- namely his past membership in a fringe party. One commenter here wants to argue that such membership constitutes treason or support for treason. To make that leap, however, requires that the commenter repudiate Article III of the US Constitution, which provides the only legitimate definition of treason under US law.

Section 3. Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort.

By his membership in the AIP, did Todd Palin levy war against the US? Clearly not. Did he adhere to the enemies of the US or give aid and comfort to the same by being a member of a non-violent political movement in which some (but far from all) members advocate the peaceful secession of Alaska from the US? Only if the First Amendment is meaningless and non-violent advocacy of a fringe political position constitutes treason.

On the other hand, the Weather Underground and William Ayers did, in fact, issue a manifesto declaring war on the US and did, in fact, make war upon the US through a series of terrorist bombings.

So would the idiot commenter above care to re-think the charge of treason?

By the way -- the same poster above wants to make opposition to communism the equivalent of engaging in terrorist attacks upon the US. In addition, he wants to make friendship with Keating BEFORE his crimes were exposed the equivalent of friendship of Ayers AFTER his terrorist activities occurred. This is quite a significant difference -- unless your position is that failure to know the future and failure to know the past are equally culpable offenses.

|| Posted by Rhymes With Right, October 18, 2008 10:20 AM ||

Rhymes With Right - Democrats Object To Fundamentally True Statement
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|| Posted by sptqwifer, February 18, 2017 07:27 AM ||
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